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aaronguy1986

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Reply with quote  #1 
A topic covered briefly in several other posts so apologies....MOT in a couple of weeks and have put off sorting the indicators since i got the car last summer!

The issue is on a 2001 registered Super Six with none of the indicators working.  The hazard and indicator switches (dash mounted rather than stalk on steering column) appear to be working as when switched the indicator relay sounds.  None of the indicators light up though.

I assume if this was an earthing issue it would only cause some of the indicators to stop working rather than all?

Ive previously replaced all the fuses (as well as the relay as this wasnt originally working) so dont suspect this will be the issue but will be rechecking one evening this week.  If the issue isnt a bad earth or fuse, any suggestions on where to start looking/most likely culprit?

All other lights and electrics work fine.  Ive got a multimeter and know some of the basics but hope someone might save me able to save me several frustrating hours chasing an easy fix.  Cheers.
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TOC_Admin

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Reply with quote  #2 
Do you have a 6 or 12 fuse loom, denoted by one or two 6-way fuse boxes respectively?
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aaronguy1986

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Reply with quote  #3 
Yeh, sorry forgot to mention - there are 7 relays and 14 fuses on mine.  From what ive read on other posts, this seems to be more than usual so not sure much i can rely on the standard wiring diagrams.  








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TOC_Admin

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Reply with quote  #4 
If you have an ECU management system, the extras probably came with that - my Webcon system has 2 extra relays and 2 extra fuses.

The flasher relay relies on the load from the lights to flash.  If you've replaced the bulbs with LEDs, you may need ballast resistors as well to generate sufficient load for the flasher to work.

Furthermore, the indicators only work with the ignition on, the hazard lights work with or without the ignition on.


The colours are standard Tiger loom wiring colours, so may vary if it's a custom loom, but the circuit should hopefully be roughly the same.

Flasher supply

Purple wire from Fuse AA1 to Flasher Relay Pin 49.

Black wire from Flasher Relay Pin 31 to Earth.

Hazard switch supply

Green / Yellow Stripe wire from Flasher Relay Pin 49a to Hazard Switch Supply.


Indicator switch supply

White wire from ignition switch live to Main Lamp Relay Pin 85 (relay coil supply).

Black wire from Mail Lamp Relay Pin 86 to Earth (relay coil earth).

Green / Yellow Stripe wire from Flasher Relay Pin 49a to Main Lamp Relay Pin 30 (relay switched supply).

Light Green wire from Main Lamp Relay Pin 87 (relay switched output) to Indicator Switch Supply (if the standard Ford switch, it's Pin 49a).


Indicator bulb supply (from switches)

Green / Red Stripe from Hazard Switch and Indicator Switch (L) to left hand indicators (in parallel).

Green / White Stripe from Hazard Switch and Indicator Switch (R) to right hand indicators (in parallel).

The other side of all bulbs should connect to earth with a black wire.


First Tests

Remove relays and plugs and check with a multimeter for continuity as above with the ignition off.

If things look good, put the main lamp relay back, put a paperclip in the holder for the flasher relay between the location for pins 49 and 49a - make sure it's not touching the chassis or anything else metallic.  Try the indicators (with ignition on) and/or hazard light, the respective lights should come on permanently.

If so, look towards replacing the flasher relay.

If not, check there is a nominal 12v from the paperclip to the chassis.  If there is, the supply is good, if not, look towards the fuse or supply to the fuse.

Report back with how you got on.
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aaronguy1986

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Reply with quote  #5 
Hi guys - firstly, thanks for the response.  Cant believe its been almost a year since the original post - house, kids etc kept bumping the car down the list but back on it now and determined to get this sorted before summer arrives!

Car is fitted with standard bulbs and not LEDs.

Been through the tests you outlined along with the wiring diagram and everything seems to be as it should be.  
 
When testing with the flasher relay out and paperclip in, the result was a decent amount of smoke!  Fuse melted/tripped as well as some of the coating for the wiring for the left hand side/near side indicators.  The fuse was a 10A but diagram shows 20A.  What should this be?  On the n/s indicators, ive got the live wires going to ground somewhere - i assume this might explain the heat?  If so, any common places this happens?

On the right hand side/offside indicators, the wiring is fine and no earthing issues however the bulbs still dont illuminate.  Ive tested them and the rear one has blown but the side and front are fine.  I assume they would still work fine on just two bulbs but is this the case?  If so, what might be causing the issue here?   

Ive got 12 volts at the indicator and hazard feed and when the switches are activated, the relay freely clicks away at the normal speed.
  
Rather frustratingly im at the stage of exhausting my electrical knowledge so hoping for saviour before the car/the lockdown drive me insane!


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Abe

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Reply with quote  #6 
All sounds a bit mixed up somewhere. Have you gone through the indicator wiring really really thoroughly, checking the cable continuity with the volt meter making sure it’s not earthing out anywhere or a random cable or connector going somewhere or plugged somewhere it shouldn’t?
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Abe

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Reply with quote  #7 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abe
All sounds a bit mixed up somewhere. Have you gone through the indicator wiring really really thoroughly, checking the cable continuity with the volt meter making sure it’s not earthing out anywhere or a random cable or connector going somewhere or plugged somewhere it shouldn’t?

Sorry probably not much help!! 🤪
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JT

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Reply with quote  #8 
Mines got a 25amp fuse. Could you have put the paperclip in the wrong pins?
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aaronguy1986

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Reply with quote  #9 
Thanks guys.

Yeh, am almost 100% sure everthing is wired correctly as have checked everything over and over - pretty much memorise the wiring diagram!

Despite the previous overheating, i decided to grow a pair and rerun the paperclip test but only on the right hand indicators (rather than off the hazards) given there didnt seem to be any issues there and finally got those working (except the rear which i think is the bulb).  Although i bought a new flasher relay previously, i noticed it said for LEDs only on it even though i ordered the right type. Ive ordered a new one and hopefully that will get them flashing.

For the left hand side, i bit the bullet and unpinned the wires and traced the issue to the side repeater.  When taking the unit apart, i noticed that the spade connectors were too large which had cuased the insulation to tear causing the ground.  Now repaired and left hand lights working too. 

Over the moon that im getting there and might be able to drive the car again soon!  Ill update again once the new relay comes.



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Abe

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Reply with quote  #10 
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronguy1986
Thanks guys.

Yeh, am almost 100% sure everthing is wired correctly as have checked everything over and over - pretty much memorise the wiring diagram!

Despite the previous overheating, i decided to grow a pair and rerun the paperclip test but only on the right hand indicators (rather than off the hazards) given there didnt seem to be any issues there and finally got those working (except the rear which i think is the bulb).  Although i bought a new flasher relay previously, i noticed it said for LEDs only on it even though i ordered the right type. Ive ordered a new one and hopefully that will get them flashing.

For the left hand side, i bit the bullet and unpinned the wires and traced the issue to the side repeater.  When taking the unit apart, i noticed that the spade connectors were too large which had cuased the insulation to tear causing the ground.  Now repaired and left hand lights working too. 

Over the moon that im getting there and might be able to drive the car again soon!  Ill update again once the new relay comes.





Excellent mate. I bet you jumped with joy finding that earthed out wire 🤩
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Dord

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Reply with quote  #11 
Isn’t it a fine feeling when you find an issue that’s been bugging you for a while. I had to strip back most of the wiring on my car when I bought it to sort out indicators, cooling fan , horn and ignition issues it was a great relief when sorted
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aaronguy1986

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Reply with quote  #12 
New relay arrived and now have flashing lights - amazing!  

The issue with the rear indicator is some more dodgy wires - both live and earth were damaged and had no continuity within the wheel arch.  So that makes issue number 3!  Should be a quick sort thought thankfully.

Have been doing some pre-MOT checks and also noticed the car doesnt have a rear fog.  It has a wired up switch but the only lights on the back are driving lights, brakes and indicators.  Will try tracing the wires to the back of the car tomorrow.  Stupid question, but do you need a rear fog to get through the MOT?  I would have thought so but just want to be sure.  If you do, i have no idea how the previous owner got the car through the MOT it had less than a month before i bought it with no rear fog and all the issues with the indicators!!
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Abe

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Reply with quote  #13 
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronguy1986
New relay arrived and now have flashing lights - amazing!  

The issue with the rear indicator is some more dodgy wires - both live and earth were damaged and had no continuity within the wheel arch.  So that makes issue number 3!  Should be a quick sort thought thankfully.

Have been doing some pre-MOT checks and also noticed the car doesnt have a rear fog.  It has a wired up switch but the only lights on the back are driving lights, brakes and indicators.  Will try tracing the wires to the back of the car tomorrow.  Stupid question, but do you need a rear fog to get through the MOT?  I would have thought so but just want to be sure.  If you do, i have no idea how the previous owner got the car through the MOT it had less than a month before i bought it with no rear fog and all the issues with the indicators!!


Yeah you’ll need one mate. Just confirmed with my mate who’s an mot tester.
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aaronguy1986

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Reply with quote  #14 
Fog light fitted and flew through its MOT yesterday. Dead chuffed. Thanks for everyone's help.
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