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snippy

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Reply with quote  #1 
Trying to correct my horn wiring. I`ve wired it up as follows but nothing. Where am I going wrong?
I`m using the usual horn push in the centre of the steering wheel. There are 2 brown wires emerging from the 2 circular rear contacts onto the column. One of these is earthed, the other is connected to the purple/black wire.
On the relay I have:-
Pin 86 - Purple/black wire from horn push button
Pin 85 - Earth
Pin 30 - Permanent 12v feed from ign/battery
Pin 87 - feed wire to horn. Horn has 2 terminals, the 2nd terminal goes to earth.

I don`t have 12v at the horn button. I think the issue lies here. I`ve tested the horn and relay and they work ok.
Any ideas? Thanks.

 

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vji4058

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Reply with quote  #2 
Have you not had it working before ? What has changed ?
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snippy

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Reply with quote  #3 
When I bought the car originally as an unfinished project it never worked until I added a 12v fused feed directly to one side of the horn switch (the side now earthed). Then, one push of the button made the horn sound momentarily before blowing the fuse. It blows fuses up to 30a with a single push. 
Can anyone post up how theirs is wired using the steering wheel centre horn push button please? It`s the only thing on the car I`m not happy with and it needs fixing.

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BCR_AK

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Reply with quote  #4 

This is how I've got a few of my relays wired (if they are the same type as yours?!):

[image]

So from the sounds of it, I think you're right, there needs to be a 12V feed at one terminal of the horn switch (rather than an earth), and the other terminal goes to pin 86 of the relay  - this forms the low power side of the relay.

Alternatively, could you wire a permanent (fused) 12V to pin 86, then pin 85 goes to the horn switch (purple/black wire) and other side of horn switch goes to earth? 

But as vji says - have you had it previously working or are you wiring from scratch?


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BCR_AK

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Reply with quote  #5 

^ sorry started writing that before your latest post.

Also need to add, I'm not using a horn button built into the steering column, i just have a separate momentary push button on the dash, but the principle should be the same I guess?


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JT

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Reply with quote  #6 
The horn button should have a 12 volt feed to 1 pin, the other needs to go to pin 86 on relay not to earth, that will just blow fuse.
Try running a temp wire from battery positive to one side of horn button, leaving the other brown going to pin 86 via purple/black wire and try horn button. If it works then the answer is to fit fused 12volt feed to horn switch.
Hope I'm making sense here.
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snippy

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Reply with quote  #7 
JT - This is how I had it initially, a live fused feed onto one side of the horn button, the other side (purple/black) going to pin 86 on relay. This just kept blowing the fuse when I pressed the button. My relay is wired as per BCR AK`s image albeit I don`t have an in line fuse between Pin 87 and the horn.
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JT

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Reply with quote  #8 
Hmm, strange, that's how it should be wired. There must be a short somewhere on that side of the circuit. Try disconnecting the black/purple at the relay and try it. If it still blows fuse then your looking for a short to earth before the relay maybe a chafed through wire or something.
With all wires disconnected you could do a continuity check between cable end and earth. They should all be open circuit. The one with continuity would be your short. I think i had a centre push button once that touched the steering boss when inserted and would blow fuses. Have you tried pressing button with the centre hanging out?
I've also known push buttons the earth the relay rather than provide a 12volt feed too it. This may not be relevant to yours.
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vji4058

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Reply with quote  #9 
The horn push button will put an earth on the horn wire and the horn needs a fixed +v connected on the other side of the horn. Make sure the horn is a true 2 wire horn and has no earth through the body, totally isolated. I think I took my +ve from one side of the temp sensor on the rad. 
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vji4058

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Reply with quote  #10 
There is a wiring diagram in the downloads section.
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TOC_Admin

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Reply with quote  #11 
As the horn button earths the connection, having +12v to the other side of the button just shorts the +12v to earth and blows the fuse.

Below is a diagram of how to do it via a relay - the +12v is a permanent +12v as the horn is supposed to work even if the ignition is off:

horn.jpg





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JT

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Reply with quote  #12 
According to first post pin 85 on relay is earth, and pin 86 goes to horn button. So either button needs to provide power to relay. Or pin 85 is removed from earth and provided with 12v+, the horn button can then earth relay, as per diagram.
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vji4058

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Reply with quote  #13 
The +ve I have used is a feed with the ign off as it keeps the fan running after turning off to cool the rad down.
After a good run on a very hot day sometimes the fan runs a while after shut down.
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snippy

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Reply with quote  #14 
OK so I've wired it up as per TOC Admins pic. I'm using a permanent live feed (with ign off) from starter motor to pins 30 & 85. I've replaced the horn with a bulb for now to give my ears a rest and the neighbours some peace. Once I switch on my master kill switch and the electrics all go live the relay clicks and the bulb illuminates. Pressing the horn button changes nothing. I don't have 12v either side of horn button either.
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vji4058

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Reply with quote  #15 
Not sure why you are using a relay if using a basic horn and not a motor type air horn.
If you look at the Tiger wiring diagram there is no relay,there is a fused +ve on one side and earth that is applied via the horn push.
Built 2 Cats and never used a relay.
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TOC_Admin

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Reply with quote  #16 
I just noticed you say that when you turn the ignition on, the relay clicks.  This means pin 86 is already earthed without the horn button being pressed.


As there is +12v to pins 30 and 85, the relay is getting power the the switch and the horn supply and passing that through the coil within the relay.

The issue is therefore a connectivity and/or continuity issue between the relay and the horn button.  This could be that the short has "burnt out" one of the wires, melting the insulation causing a short.

I would suggest disconnecting pin 86 from the relay and temporaily running a wire from ping 86 to the horn button.  This should connect to a unit with 2 spring loaded pins (if I remember correctly) fixed somewhere on the back of the steering column.  These then touch a "ring" which is then wired to the horn button in the middle of the wheel.  check continuity for +12v to one of the two pins and then, with the wheel on to one or other of the rings.

There are some pictures of the "ring" on the following eBay Advert:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ford-Sierra-Steering-Wheel-Push-Horn-Pick-Up-Ring-Full-Range-Mk2-Sierra-kit-Car-/264171044143


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snippy

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Reply with quote  #17 
Sussed it! Tested all the wiring which was fine. Decided to remove the steering wheel as I was still convinced the problem lay there. With the wheel off joining the 2 spring loaded pins switched the circuit fine. I then discovered that one of the 2 brass rings inside the boss was hanging off. I`m guessing this was shorting against the other ring and not seating properly. There is only a 2mm gap between the 2 rings.  I`ve glued it back in place, put it all back together and hey presto.
Appreciate everyone`s efforts and idea`s with this. Thanks troops!

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JT

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Reply with quote  #18 
Well done. 👍👍😁😁
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