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Monster_UK

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Reply with quote  #1 
What should have been a simple job (replacing wheel studs) is now turning into something of a saga!  This job is the first I've done on the rear end of the car and I've discovered something I'm uncomfortable with.

I have two questions (!).  The first is should I be uncomfortable and the second is if my proposed solution is sensible.

I've recently had the rear wheels off and I've now noticed the there is a 10mm spacer on the rear which means that the wheel does not come into contact with the spindle/hub at all.  The spacer is not hub-centric and there is no spigot ring.  I think the spacer has been added because the central bore on the wheels is around 58mm in diameter and the hub is around 64mm in diameter.  In my mind this means only the studs are resisting vertical forces.  I don't think this is what they are intended to do and I suspect that I'm risking shearing them.  Am I right in thinking the wheel should locate onto the hub to that the vertical forces are transferred directly and the studs only used to provide lateral force?

Here are a couple of picture of the spacer and then one looking down the centre of the wheel (you can see the gap between the wheel and the hub).

106708884_939319699874277_7444575735694532061_n.jpg 
104771235_197432961565480_4708536083575471243_n.jpg 
Question one is am I right to be concerned?

If I am here is my proposed solution, a custom spacer that will fit over the wheel hub and provide something for the wheel to centre on.  It will have to 13mm in thickness rather than the 10mm now but I think that will leave me with enough stud (I currently get about 6 and 1/2 turns on the nuts).

Spacer.jpg 
I have no ides who I will get to fabricate this if it is sensible but it doesn't look that complicated to make... thoughts?


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Abe

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Reply with quote  #2 
I see what you mean mate but aren’t the rings purely to aid with alignment rather than load, if it was load they wouldn’t make plastic ones would they?
In my mind the face between the back of the wheel and the drum/spacer/disc and the subsequent even tightening and torquing of the tapered wheel nuts/bolts pulls it into alignment anyway and takes all the loading. Someone will correct me if I’m wrong no doubt 🤔👍
Nice drawing btw! 😁🤩
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Reply with quote  #3 
Does make sense for the centres to sit in some sort of lip though I guess, keeps it super central? Good topic, got my brain working 🤣
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Monster_UK

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Reply with quote  #4 
Just a bit of google sketch up :)

I’m not convinced that everything is sitting properly on the left hand side and would be more comfortable knowing that everything was at least lined up properly. It can’t hurt to give the studs a bit of support too. Depends on the prices I get back I suppose.

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Gazza

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Reply with quote  #5 
Hi Monster_UK

You need to speak to Paul at Tiger Racing about the wheel spacer issue as they shouldnt be required.

It might be a case of a previous owner has fitted different wheels which needed the spacer to give the offset required.

Paul should be able to advise you on the best solution.

Gazza

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Monster_UK

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Reply with quote  #6 
Hi Gazza,

I'll try Paul.  I don't think it's about offset.  The spacer has been used because the diameter of the hub (I think that's the term for the bit that sticks out!!) is larger than the central bore on the wheels meaning the wheel won't see properly against a flat surface.

The problem came to my attention when I swapped the tyres.  The first time I drove the car away after putting the new tyres on there was a disturbingly loud metallic rattling from the left rear.  I pulled up straight away and found it was the spacer moving around meaning the wheel was only seated on the the end of the hub and not tight to any flat surface.  It's been really bugging me how this could be the case given all I did was take the wheels off, have the tyres swapped and put them back on.

It's just popped into my mind that I wonder if the previous owner had the central bore on two of the wheel modified slightly and I've put a wheel intended for the back on the front and vice versa.  Should be easy to check as the right rear is on fine.  If I swap those over and the left is tight and the right loose then I've likely not paid attention to something I should have.  I just assumed all the wheels would be the same.  

Tim



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Reply with quote  #7 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monster_UK
I pulled up straight away and found it was the spacer moving around meaning the wheel was only seated on the the end of the hub and not tight to any flat surface.


Even without using hub centric spacers that should not happen.  Doing up the wheel nuts will clamp the wheel against the spacer which is clamped against the hub.

The front of the Six uses VW Golf hubs, whereas the back comes from a Ford Cortina (IIRC).  The VW uses a 57.1mm centre bore whilst Ford uses a 63.4mm centre bore

Therefore, it's entirely possible that either the wheels are swapped around front to rear, or the purchaser bought wheels for a Golf and then found they didn't fit on the Ford rear so bought the spacers as a cheap solution to the problem.

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Reply with quote  #8 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monster_UK
Hi Gazza,

I'll try Paul.  I don't think it's about offset.  The spacer has been used because the diameter of the hub (I think that's the term for the bit that sticks out!!) is larger than the central bore on the wheels meaning the wheel won't see properly against a flat surface.

The problem came to my attention when I swapped the tyres.  The first time I drove the car away after putting the new tyres on there was a disturbingly loud metallic rattling from the left rear.  I pulled up straight away and found it was the spacer moving around meaning the wheel was only seated on the the end of the hub and not tight to any flat surface.  It's been really bugging me how this could be the case given all I did was take the wheels off, have the tyres swapped and put them back on.

It's just popped into my mind that I wonder if the previous owner had the central bore on two of the wheel modified slightly and I've put a wheel intended for the back on the front and vice versa.  Should be easy to check as the right rear is on fine.  If I swap those over and the left is tight and the right loose then I've likely not paid attention to something I should have.  I just assumed all the wheels would be the same.  

Tim




Oh man! Glad you spotted that!
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Monster_UK

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Reply with quote  #9 
I've always been happy admitting when I've been an idiot and I've been an idiot!!  Whoever built the car had two of the wheels machined to remove the taper so they fit the rear wheel hub properly.  I hadn't noticed and put one of the wheel from the front on the rear and vice versa.  Just popped down to the garage and swapped them over and it's all fine... [crazy]
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Reply with quote  #10 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monster_UK
I've always been happy admitting when I've been an idiot and I've been an idiot!!  Whoever built the car had two of the wheels machined to remove the taper so they fit the rear wheel hub properly.  I hadn't noticed and put one of the wheel from the front on the rear and vice versa.  Just popped down to the garage and swapped them over and it's all fine... [crazy]


Heehee well done mate. 🤩👌

Good job you didn’t get those spacers made!
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